Friday, September 17, 2010

BAC Dress #10


IMG_5995, originally uploaded by bucklesw1.

Posted by Buckles at 9/17/2010 06:08:00 AM

16 comments:

JOHNNY said...

I am amazed that the equestrian arts have reached such a low point that they have a pony drill performing without harness. But I am aware that the trainer knows the boss, so that is not new in our business. Too bad when we see Togni, Knie, Gruss. Krone and this is Americas biggy. This is not sour grapes but a professional assessment. I recall when Vander Barbette visited us on the Gil Gray Circus at bwhifch time he staged and choreographed the fabulous production on Louie Stern Polack. ASked what he thought of the wardrobe with Gil Gray he remarked, "Made at home with loving hands" TANGLEFOOT HERRIOTT

17 September, 2010 17:00
Chic Silber said...

My favorite story of a Barbette

quote was when he was shown some

wardrobe that included several

rather ratty garments & was told

that they were "rainy day" he

responded "It Could Never Rain

That Hard"

17 September, 2010 20:44
J C Hall said...

Johnny
Apparently you did not train this act?
In regards to low points;
Strictly my opinion but the act in question, be it nepotism or not, is "pretty sharp". Have you seen it? They thread the needle and all. As for the past history of equine acts on the BAC, there is no doubt that they have shown the varieties of colors of fog that can be used over a multitude of years.Also the no harness bit seems to go along with the ambiance of fogs of different colors as seen on a lot of European horsey acts also lacking in harness. As horse trainers go you have always rated quite high in my book and I have been highly entertained by your daughters ponies also by Europeant acts lacking in harness. (But what the hell do I know).
Visiting the BAC, I too, like you have been amazed; though I feel truly by a horse of a different color.

17 September, 2010 22:08
Jimmy Cole said...

One of the most raved about liberty acts of the 1980's was the P.O.A.s of the late Wayne Franzen.

It too worked with no harness.

18 September, 2010 08:53
Anonymous said...

Glad to see you are still making sure I get it right Jimmy. I have the greatest respect for Jenny and her accomplishments and she does it the hard way; driving the truck, grooming, etc. Always with that pleasant smile on her face. We have seen the "twins" grow up over the years and she and Al were very close and his liberty ponies and expertise were her life to follow. I also admire that she does train her own stuff, so nothing phoney about that. Having been involved in this stuff for so many years and seeing almost all of the trainer-presenters I have been able to pretty well recognize someones bability and to what degree of excellence they have achieved. I have seen Jenny with this white pony act at various places [big and little shows] and it has always been very nice except that some will miss a waltz, turn the wrong way, get out of position, etc. I note the picture shows a regular "cut back" kind of strung out and is not a "thread the needle" unless you are referring to the popular "triple weave" routine. So Jenny does her thing and I applaud her efforts but reserve my right to make my assessement weather it be a Herriott or someone else. I recall some years ago when Carmen had just a great dog and pony act. High caliber, well presented. Unusual tricks and routine. I just saw Sylvia's offering at "Cavalo" Very poor and she is sure out of her element. The whole show was alot of mediocre crap in every segment.

Incidentally first reports about Jenny and BAC was that she was training a new liberty horse act, so I guess that was all PR bullshit. Hope I have enlightened you to some degree. Incidentally I just saw video of all the great liberty acts in Europe and it is awsome. As good as anything before and some exquisite harness and plumes. I applaud them and am sure they would be a tough act to follow. The only thing impressive in a no-harness liberty act is the "oblique". Lets see now; tweklve sets of harness with ostrich plumes at todays prices would be about a grand apiece, Ponies are worth about three bills a piece tops. I always had Don McClennon harness. Red patent leather, German silver hardware with backpads overchecks, kidney drops. I note now Ringling has black leather cobbled up in Tampa with belt spots stuck on. progress, Sincerely Johnny

18 September, 2010 09:33
Casey McCoy Cainan said...

"I note the picture shows a regular "cut back" kind of strung out and is not a "thread the needle" unless you are referring to the popular "triple weave" routine."


I note it is dress rehearsal. Would be great to see a photo about a week from now.

19 September, 2010 06:45
johnny said...

Yes Jimmy he even trained them without harness. Wayne was a smart guy and also quite frugal. He saw my twelve pony act in Baraboo and liked it, so he bought 12 Apaloosa POA s. Larger than shetlands. Now he had a tent that he erected always at the back door and the ponies were carraled in there like cattle, never tied up. At there time they were herded directly in the ring and the end of the act was each turning at the back and out to the corral. Act was over. No harness or plumes to take off. Nothing to be tied up. Just keep water barrel full, throw some hay if not a grassy lot and ready for the next show. Draw back was he kept the tent corral up at night so gazoonies had to take it down, scrap up crap before making the jump, but you can be sure Wayne was right out there pulling stakes, shoveling crap, quiye a guy. Now the Appys were beautifully colored and they showed up niceley without harness.Waynes cat act was cat trailer backed up between sidepoles. No chute or portable cages. Just jump them into the arena. Soon as act was over Wayne put on a robe and they dismantled cage and props in possum bellies and cat act was ready to go to the next town. No worry on tear down about that. Wayne would have liked to work "INdoor dates" shrine, etc. but would have had to rebuild as doubt where he would have space in back door fo pony carral and Arena. but for him it was ideal and eliminated some problems. On bad nights he could jump the POA s in a trailer overnight. A good mud show trouper and owner.

19 September, 2010 08:44
Wade G. Burck said...

I have always agreed with Col. Herriott about harness on a horse, but I have to really wonder if ponies/miniature have anything to do with "equestrian arts." They are a small horse, that's it. A liberty horse will always be "strung out", sloppy a Casey noted, as was Wayne's, without harness. As far as I am concerned the more leather, iron, due dads, conchos, inlays, overchecks, martingales, etc. etc. on a horse the better they look, as well as work, and that includes all the bridleless nonsense all the rage at the moment. The "love and kindness BS" that is associated with no harness, is just that, BS. It just makes them look more charismatic and macho. Just like a headpiece on an elephant, doing mount's or not. But an odd thing has happened the past few years. Folks think an animal want's to work, and it want's to perform. Go figure that out. This is even stranger. A few years ago, Krone did a public survey and one of the things folks objected to was FEATHERS ON THE HORSES!!!! To a lesser degree, harness on the horses. That is why it is all the rage, here and in Europe. Not much to do with finances on Knie, Johnny. A number of year ago(a whole bunch of years ago, actually) Marineland in Canada did a similar "survey" one summer, long before animal rights gained steam, and the only real "objection" to the show that was presented there(it has been called the greatest animal, land and sea show of all time) was the fact that the bears wore clothes/costumes!!!! To bad the world has come to that. To bad folks keep training/presenting them without harness in order to keep perpetrating the myth that bit's and harness are cruel. You will never again see a real "beautiful" liberty act, with precision, tempo, and co ordination with out the gear. You will never see a horse perform to perfection bridleless, either. It is why animal act's hav become yawners. Old school of thought(the alibi, as Col. Herriott pointed out a few days ago) was that they were leaving because they perceived cruelty in the training. Wrong, they have left because they are bored spitless. Kinda like looking at a football player without his uniform. Then he is just a man, nothing special.
Wade Burck

19 September, 2010 11:25
Jimmy Cole said...

Personally, I believe that a Liberty Horse...or Pony act is 100% pure traditional circus. I also agree that it looks very impressive when they are in colorful harness and plumes.

But I also admire animal trainers and circuses who try something different.

All I did was to comment on how well recieved Wayne Franzen's POA act was (25 years ago), with no mention of anyone else. Yes, the act was geared almost exclusivly for the Franzen Bros. Circus big top. At the time it was quite unique for a liberty act to work with "no harness", which of course had been done before by other trainers.

The act got a lot of good comments from circus fans and show people alike. Although I doubt that 95% of the ticket buying audience even noticed that they had no harness on.

19 September, 2010 13:28
J C Hall said...

To Johnny
Subject: Amazements in reaching suck low points in equestrian arts by BAC's pony drill?
Johnny, loved your second comment. It gives me such hopes to see my elder idols keeping up there aquatic skills in the back stroke.
Have you seen this BAC show??????
As I have not,however like your comments from the past, I have spent two seasons with Jenny and got suckered into helping her practice with her group of steeds. She has a thread the needle in her pony act and apparently in many numerous groupings of equine there is almost at least one knot-head to keep things exciting and the ponies at that time were no exception. Jenny did a lot of practicing.
As for questioning my horsey credentials, I feel 100% confident in stating that the likes of Wade Burck,Casey Cainan and myself (JC Hall) are no strangers in the art of walking ponies on a pony sweep with effortless precision.
Stranger than it seams, BAC once had a guy working an unharnessed uncaged parakeet act.
During rehearsals this same gent stepped into the ring with their horses and was no stranger in that art. Mentioning this to Buckles he than filled me in on the man's credentials. He went by the name of Norman Barrett.
My question to you? Have you now or ever trained Parakeets? And if so were you at some time turned down by BAC.?????
PS.May all our days be Circus Days.
JC. Hall

20 September, 2010 12:29
Jimmy Cole said...

Johnny, All kidding aside...do I recall at Circus World Museum around 40+ years ago, when for one reason or another you either presented or practiced the 12 pony libery act with no harness?

Seems I recall them working almost letter perfect...just a lot faster.
Miss Ethel & her Hammond Organ could hardly keep up with the tempo. Think there might have been another horse trainer visiting that day?

Did this happen, or am I starting to have senior moments? It may have occured only once or twice.

20 September, 2010 13:19
J C Hall said...

To Jimmy Cole
Question; Did Colonel Herriott use any Fog during this possible event? If so what colors????

20 September, 2010 14:49
Chic Silber said...

Careful how you disparage "fog"

Jimmy as that currently makes

up a large portion of my income

In November I'm off to Korea to

make some fog (& smoke & haze)

for Disney's "Aida" (again)

20 September, 2010 16:36
Jimmy Cole said...

Jimmy Hall, The "fog" may be in my memory...otherwise it was the sawdust being kicked up by the 12 ponies.

20 September, 2010 16:43
Chic Silber said...

By the way Jimmy fog is the color

of whatever light you put on it

20 September, 2010 16:46
Anonymous said...

To Jimmy' The first year at Lincoln Center Paul Binder visited me On CBCB and asked me to ride my Horse American Anthem in that proposed show. During nthat preliminary time he saw Katja Schumann in Europe and made a deal with her. She came here with a horse on loan from Knie and early in the engagement some punks, I guess SWtarted the back area horse stable on fire and the horse suffocated. So immediately BAC Paul and David Balding [administrater] called me if I had High school horse for Katja to ride. I had three and they immediately flew Katja to Sarasota and the same time after arrival she practiced a few minutes and liked Lady Dancer. We called BAC put Katja on a plane and I drove nonstop with horse trailer to Lincoln Center. Arrived around 8am. Katja practiced around 930am and did A 11;00am show to the public. Horse did complete routine plus beautiful canter-rears and worked perfect. Katja had never spent even a full hour practicibg. After the act we hugged, laughed and cried and flew home and then flew back up at engagements end. Katja came to Sarasota and spent some couple weeks with us. I took her to all the circus animal people and she got acquainted. We have been fast friends since. It was a credit to her ability to ride high school and I was proud of my training. She remarked thay riding High School is like playing the piano and that each person should know the proper notes. Thought you might like the history lesson. I later appeared with my wife for the summer season with her giant poodle act and I rode High School on my Appy Stallion and had a HArlequin Great Dane that worked on the ground in time with the horse like Erna Rudynoff had done. Also I trained my first "big and little" act for BAC and it was presented there by my DAughter Heidi and later became the standard act for David Balding and I was quite pleased when Anouk showed it to perfection and on TV at the prestigeous National Horse Show in our Nations Capital. So yea Jimmy I do have a very pleasant history with BAC circus and when they wintered here Paul Binder and I spent many afternoons playing golf, so you can be sure I am not frustrated. PS. I have never seen the Jenny ponies do a thread the needle.John herriott


To Jimmy Cole' You are confused. The 12 ponies worked like a clock after seasoning and we would practice them [escercinze] without harness and frequently Frankie Braun would run them thru it. Frankie did work the elephant act with Laura when I got tied up with Parade meetings, etc. I bought Frankie A used uniform in Chicago. As you know he never liked being a "Kinker". Wonderful days and times and tou were part of it.johnny

21 September, 2010 00:33

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